Roleplayer's Off Topic Thread #42

[TheCzarsHussar]

I hope "Filthy Canadian Commie Executer" Sole Survivor shows up in the show to shoot more people in the head

[BigBossBalrog]

He's become Pete Hines 

[TheCzarsHussar]

43 minutes ago, BigBossBalrog said:

He's become Pete Hines 

I'm gonna slap what little hair remains off his dumb ass head.

[The Good Doctor]

1 hour ago, BigBossBalrog said:

He's become Pete Hines 

Nah, Pete would’ve told the diehards to grow up or go play Pong if they want to live in the past. I don’t think Emil was trying to insult anyone; it just comes across that way because he’s a bad writer.  

As much as I would love to see more isometric, the Fallout series works well enough in 1st/3rd person. Gameplay perspective is the least of my issues with Bethesda’s handling of the IP.

[The Good Doctor]

That said, if Bethesda were to give Sawyer permission to make an isometric Fallout spinoff using the Deadfire engine, I would be stoked.  

Regardless of perspective, Obsidian are good enough at their job that they retroactively improved certain elements about Fallout 3, so if anyone could make repairs to the setting after the damage done by the show, it would be them.

Doubt it ever happens, though, considering the alleged jealousy at Bethesda over New Vegas being the fan favorite.

[BigBossBalrog]

Todd just confirmed there's other NCR remnant factions and we haven't seen the "last" of them. 

https://www.ign.com/articles/the-big-fallout-interview-todd-howard-and-jonathan-nolan-answer-our-burning-questions-about-season-1

[ColonelKillaBee]

On 4/15/2024 at 8:46 AM, The Good Doctor said:

 

I don’t follow. The Great War is the backdrop that creates the Fallout setting.

Thats my point

Tes has big cataclysmic events sure, but usually theyre stopped by the, or a hero and nothing big changes really in the actual games, for the most part. Big stuff happens in the background and most fans dont read up much on all that. Eso notwithstanding, it doesnt happen in your face.

Fallout is not like that tho and right off the bat boom you have a nuclear war and winter to think about for the setting as a whole. So things getting nuked in fallout seems right compared to the extreme example given for tes and windhelm. Not that it couldnt happen, but unless its a far distant future in some obscure lore or in a place not relevant to the games in the past, stuff like that usually doesnt happen.

Biggest thing that happened that affected everyone was the oblivion crisis, then red mountain going off after baar dau fell, and the great war. None of these things erased a nation even though they came close. Tes just isnt that kind of setting whereas fallout right from the start wiped out most life on earth as we know it.

[The Good Doctor]

48 minutes ago, BigBossBalrog said:

Todd just confirmed there's other NCR remnant factions and we haven't seen the "last" of them. 

https://www.ign.com/articles/the-big-fallout-interview-todd-howard-and-jonathan-nolan-answer-our-burning-questions-about-season-1

So basically "The NCR is very big, but we’re not talking about them except in this one location".

Fair enough. But if they’re still alive and well outside of L.A., then why does Maximus say they’re gone, why are Moldaver’s remnants getting no support, and why weren’t the citizens who survived relocated to other states?

[ColonelKillaBee]

That major difference in setting narrative imo is why most people dont take fallout lore that seriously, because from the start they're met with such an extreme world building cataclysmic event that no one can really picture the true outcome of if that were to actually happen.

[The Good Doctor]

1 minute ago, ColonelKillaBee said:

So things getting nuked in fallout seems right compared to the extreme example given for tes and windhelm.

I disagree, pretty fundamentally in fact. But we can save it for a Discord call or something because I don’t have the time or energy for texting an argument right now.  

[The Good Doctor]

2 minutes ago, ColonelKillaBee said:

most people dont take fallout lore that seriously, 

If this is true, it is only because Bethesda themselves don’t take it seriously and treat the setting like a quirky playground where anything can happen. Fans of the West Coast games tend to take the lore very seriously and always have. 

[BigBossBalrog]

6 minutes ago, The Good Doctor said:

So basically "The NCR is very big, but we’re not talking about them except in this one location".

Fair enough. But if they’re still alive and well outside of L.A., then why does Maximus say they’re gone, why are Moldaver’s remnants getting no support, and why weren’t the citizens who survived relocated to other states?

Maximus is a dumb ass, and maybe the other groups are super insular and kind of have blocked all contact with the other parts because of a war?

[BigBossBalrog]

Clearly Colonel hasn't visited No Mutants Allowed 

[The Good Doctor]

17 minutes ago, BigBossBalrog said:

Maximus is a dumb ass, and maybe the other groups are super insular and kind of have blocked all contact with the other parts because of a war?

Then it’s not the NCR. It’s a fractured bunch of independent mini-states. I’d call it a failure of the show that it never gave any reason to believe such things exist. But I’ll take Todd’s word for it.

But Todd also confirmed that Shady Sands got nuked very shortly after the events of New Vegas, so that excuse shouldn’t work unless we’re to believe that the nation immediately collapsed and divided itself right after it happened.

Which would be pretty weird considering that a willingness to protect its citizens (even at the expense of others) is one of the few positive traits that the NCR is actually consistently shown to possess. It’s the entire purpose of the Rangers and groups like those missionaries who started a mini war in Freeside over a small group of Kings bullying their citizens.

[BigBossBalrog]

Then maybe Moldaver's group is rogue element. Maybe the rest of the NCR (which is undergoing rapid upheaval) think's that part of their territory (which has now become a wasteland...somehow) isn't worth saving, while Moldaver and her men are trying to figure a way to bring it back. (It is the heart of the NCR after all).  

I still think I'd take the word of Patches over a person like Maximus 

[The Good Doctor]

12 minutes ago, BigBossBalrog said:

Then maybe Moldaver's group is rogue element. Maybe the rest of the NCR (which is undergoing rapid upheaval) think's that part of their territory (which has now become a wasteland...somehow) isn't worth saving, while Moldaver and her men are trying to figure a way to bring it back. (It is the heart of the NCR after all).  

That sounds like an halfway interesting story. I wish they’d told it.

Although I don’t see how things could’ve gotten so bad in so little time. It feels like the place got nuked a century ago and that the NCR is all but forgotten (except by those weird NCR cultists in the vault… which only enhances the point), not a recent event that we’re watching survivors pick up the pieces from.

[BigBossBalrog]

1 minute ago, The Good Doctor said:

That sounds like an halfway interesting story. I wish they’d told it.  

Although I don’t see how things could’ve gotten so bad in so little time. It feels like the place got nuked a century ago and that the NCR is all but forgotten (except by those weird NCR cultists in the vault… which only enhances the point), not a recent event that we’re watching survivors pick up the pieces from.

Yeah it's been like fifteen years 

[The Good Doctor]

35 minutes ago, BigBossBalrog said:

Yeah it's been like fifteen years 

You won’t hear this often, but Fallout 76 did it better.  

Most characters in that game were born prewar, still remember civilization, and thus behave like relatively normal people who’ve just been forced to adapt to a shitty world. They didn’t instantly devolve into crazy wastelanders and primitive tribals; that’s implied to be the fate of future generations.

The exception were the raider gangs. But they had been trapped in the mountains with limited resources and forced to survive on murder and cannibalism until the passes cleared up, which is a far more reasonable explanation for rapid degeneration than simply losing one city in the middle of a developed nation.

[ColonelKillaBee]

1 hour ago, The Good Doctor said:

If this is true, it is only because Bethesda themselves don’t take it seriously and treat the setting like a quirky playground where anything can happen.

I mean Im not arguing against that at all lol, but most people today started with Fallout 3, so unfortunately whether yall like it or not that quirky silliness that is iconic to Fallout is what most people think of for the series. 

Even though I prefer FNV, F3 is the first game I played like many, and its a lasting impression. Hell even FNV isnt fully void of that. Despite the seriousness of the setting story and situation. And yea I know you arent against any comical relief, but Im saying that its an overbranching theme with the series. Tbh even 1 and 2 from what I have seen has this to some extent, there is much humor to the series that imo makes such extreme scenarios easier to swallow overall.

But thats just my opinion.

[ColonelKillaBee]

The comedy tho is almost always what i hear people talking about in the show and the quirkiness, as far as what people love. I think that says more than any debate we could have about it.

[The Good Doctor]

6 minutes ago, ColonelKillaBee said:

And yea I know you arent against any comical relief, but Im saying that its an overbranching theme with the series. Tbh even 1 and 2 from what I have seen has this to some extent,

To be clear, I do not dispute this at all. Fallout has always and should always have some degree of humor in it. That is not mutually exclusive from telling stories that are serious or good. Even Bethesda has tried in the past to balance the two, they just suck at it.

[The Good Doctor]

2 minutes ago, ColonelKillaBee said:

The comedy tho is almost always what i hear people talking about in the show and the quirkiness, as far as what people love. I think that says more than any debate we could have about it.

Like I said, I really don’t care what other people think or feel, just like I don’t expect them to care what I think or feel. Bethesda could go a step further and turn Fallout into a full-blown slapstick comedy with fart jokes, Family Guy cutaways, and no coherent storyline to speak of, and there’d probably still be millions who’d lap it up based on the brand alone. That wouldn’t get me to pretend I think it’s good. 

[Celan]

1 hour ago, The Good Doctor said:

That sounds like an halfway interesting story. I wish they’d told it.

Although I don’t see how things could’ve gotten so bad in so little time. It feels like the place got nuked a century ago and that the NCR is all but forgotten (except by those weird NCR cultists in the vault… which only enhances the point), not a recent event that we’re watching survivors pick up the pieces from.

I always figured Moldaver was leading a splinter group since she obviously just woke up from cryo (or whatever kept her alive) not long before events of the show and immediately started agitating against Vault Tec and using NCR survivors as followers/ cannon fodder.

Since Shady Sands was destroyed that takes out the government and it's plausible that the rest of the society would fracture if there's not a clear successor that wasn't nuked.

Like I said up above somewhere, I'm not surprised that they did a "reset." It was probably inevitable with the decision to set the show in California.

[ColonelKillaBee]

1 hour ago, The Good Doctor said:

Like I said, I really don’t care what other people think or feel, just like I don’t expect them to care what I think or feel. Bethesda could go a step further and turn Fallout into a full-blown slapstick comedy with fart jokes, Family Guy cutaways, and no coherent storyline to speak of, and there’d probably still be millions who’d lap it up based on the brand alone. That wouldn’t get me to pretend I think it’s good. 

My point isnt about if its good or not, I havent seen it yet still. I did watch three episodes of Arcane today tho ^^

Im just sayin that the extreme events described in the show befits fallout more than it does tes

[The Good Doctor]

2 minutes ago, Celan said:

Since Shady Sands was destroyed that takes out the government and it's plausible that the rest of the society would fracture if there's not a clear successor that wasn't nuked.

In the show’s own lore, Shady Sands doesn’t appear to have been the seat of the NCR’s federal government anymore by the time it got nuked. The sign said it was "The first capital of the NCR", suggesting that it had relocated, likely as a result of whatever "the fall" is.

But even as the capital, Shady Sands was just one state of many, and arguably not even the most powerful or important. In Lonesome Road, you can argue to Ulysses that all the missiles in the Divide wouldn’t be enough to destroy the NCR, and he acknowledges this as true.

That’s why his plan is to nuke a stretch of the Long 15 instead. Cut the NCR off from the Mojave, guarantee the Legion takes Vegas, and position Caesar to invade California like barbarians sacking Rome and do what a few bombs couldn’t.

25 minutes ago, Celan said:

Like I said up above somewhere, I'm not surprised that they did a "reset." It was probably inevitable with the decision to set the show in California.

Which sucks, doesn’t it? Three games of worldbuilding out the window. And even if it must be destroyed, New Vegas set up several compelling ways to do it, and instead Bethesda went with the only one that had a good explanation for why it wouldn’t work.